This week’s Pipeliners Podcast episode features Mike Falk of Burns & McDonnell discussing the demand for natural gas, greenhouse emissions, and the differences between just pure natural gas and a mix of natural gas and hydrogen.
In this episode, you will learn about the ways the gas demand has changed over the years, by what method the gas is getting to the markets that need it, as well as how to reduce greenhouse emissions while delivering the gas. Hydrogen is also a large topic of discussion in the episode. Russel and Mike also converse about the way hydrogen is going to impact our ability to reduce emissions but still meet the necessary demands.
New Gas Supply in Existing Pipelines: Show Notes, Links, and Insider Terms
- Mike Falk is a Senior Technical Consultant with Burns & McDonnell. Connect with Mike on LinkedIn.
- Burns & McDonnell is a family of companies bringing together an unmatched team of 10,000+ engineers, construction professionals, architects, planners, technologists and scientists to help those who work in critical infrastructure sectors deliver on their imperative responsibilities. With an integrated construction and design mindset, the company offers full-service capabilities with more than 60 offices, globally. With a mission unchanged since 1898 — make our clients successful — Burns & McDonnell partner with companies on the toughest challenges, constantly working to make the world an amazing place. Learn more at burnsmcd.com.
- INGAA (Interstate Natural Gas Association of America) is a trade organization that advocates regulatory and legislative positions of importance to the natural gas pipeline industry in North America. INGAA is comprised of 26 members, representing the vast majority of the interstate natural gas transmission pipeline companies in the U.S. and Canada. INGAA members operate almost 200,000 miles of pipeline.
- PHMSA (Pipeline and Hazardous Materials Safety Administration) ensures the safe transportation of energy and hazardous materials.
- MAOP (maximum allowable operating pressure) was included in a bulletin issued by PHSMA informing owners and operators of gas transmission pipelines that if the pipeline pressure exceeds MAOP plus the build-up allowed for operation of pressure-limiting or control devices, the owner or operator must report the exceedance to PHMSA on or before the fifth day following the date on which the exceedance occurs. If the pipeline is subject to the regulatory authority of one of PHMSA’s State Pipeline Safety Partners, the exceedance must also be reported to the applicable state agency.
- AGA (American Gas Association) represents companies delivering natural gas safely, reliably, and in an environmentally responsible way to help improve the quality of life for their customers every day. AGA’s mission is to provide clear value to its membership and serve as the indispensable, leading voice and facilitator on its behalf in promoting the safe, reliable, and efficient delivery of natural gas to homes and businesses across the nation.
- British Thermal Unit (BTU) is the amount of energy needed to raise 1 pound of water by 1 degree Fahrenheit while at sea level.
- Barlow’s Equation captures the internal pressure that a piece of pipe can withstand based on its dimensions, composition, and strength of its materials. The formula is P= (2*T*S/D).
- P = pressure
- S = allowable stress
- t = wall thickness
- D = outside diameter
- O&M (Operations & Maintenance) is a comprehensive approach to performing pipeline tasks related to the operation and maintenance of gas and liquid pipeline systems. A robust O&M program provides personnel with the knowledge and understanding of each situation to enable them to correctly assess the situation and take corrective action.
- The PRCI (Pipeline Research Council International) is the preeminent global collaborative research development organization of, by, and for the energy pipeline industry.
- FERC (Federal Energy Regulatory Commission) regulates, monitors, and investigates electricity, natural gas, hydropower, oil matters, natural gas pipelines, LNG terminals, hydroelectric dams, electric transmission, energy markets, and pricing.
- FERC Gas Tariff or tariff means a compilation, on electronic media, of all of the effective rate schedules of a particular natural gas company, and a copy of each form of service agreement.
New Gas Supply in Existing Pipelines: Full Episode Transcript
Russel Treat: Welcome to the Pipeliners Podcast, episode 239, sponsored by Burns & McDonnell, delivering pipeline projects with an integrated construction and design mindset, connecting all the elements, design, procurement, sequencing at the site. Burns & McDonnell uses its vast knowledge, the latest technology, and ownership commitment to safely deliver innovative, quality projects. Burns & McDonnell is designed to build and keep it all connected. Learn more at burnsmcd.com.
Announcer: The Pipeliners Podcast, where professionals, Bubba geeks, and industry insiders share their knowledge and experience about technology, projects, and pipeline operations. And now, your host, Russel Treat.
Russel: Thanks for listening to the Pipeliners Podcast. I appreciate you taking the time, and to show that appreciation, we give away a customized YETI tumbler to one listener each episode. This week, our winner is Brandon Bose with Energy Transfer. Congratulations, Brandon. Your YETI is on its way. To learn how you can win this signature prize, stick around until the end of the episode.
This week, Mike Falk, Senior Technical Consultant with Burns & McDonnell, joins us to talk about supporting new gas supply through existing pipelines. Mike, welcome to the Pipeliners Podcast.
Michael Falk: Thanks for having me, Russel. I appreciate the opportunity to talk about this.
Russel: Hey, before we get going, maybe you could tell us a little bit about yourself. I know we did this a little bit back at Orlando. I managed to grab you by the arm and make you sit in front of a camera for a few minutes, but this being your first time on the podcast, probably a good idea to get you to tell everybody who you are.
Michael: I’ve been in the pipeline industry now since 1981, about 40 years, mostly on the interstate gas transmission side, operations and engineering management. A short stint in the middle at DOT PHMSA, so I have some regulatory compliance background, and then, for the last two and a half years, with Burns & McDonnell in the engineering consulting design for pipeline and facilities.
Russel: We’ve brought you on because we want to talk about the natural gas systems and how we’re going to meet the demand requirements, given today’s realities. Maybe before we get too deep into that, you can tell us a little bit about the work you’re doing with INGAA.
Michael: INGAA is the group that is comprised only of operators, and I was a long time member of that from the interstate gas transmission side. INGAA Foundation is where service providers, consultants like Burns & McDonnell can participate.
I’m the chair of the INGAA Foundation study on how to achieve hydrogen blending in gas transmission assets and underground storage assets, both significant challenges to do on the transmission side. We are currently getting ready to draft the final report on that study. It should be out sometime in August.
Russel: Interesting. What is the reality, if you will, around…Actually, there’s several “What is the reality?” questions I want to ask. The first is, what’s the reality around gas supply and getting gas to the markets that need it? What’s the nature of what’s going on in our industry? There’s a lot up in that conversation, I think.
Michael: I think, at a very basic level, gas supply in our industry starts with the producing fields, both onshore here in the US, and also offshore, primarily in the Gulf of Mexico. That gas is produced, processed, and delivered into both transmission and distribution systems all across this country.
Their supply also comes in from Canada. That primarily travels first through the gas transmission systems all across the country, and then delivered to the distribution utilities for consumption within their more localized regional operations that serves a variety of end users, both industrial, commercial, and residential loads.
That gas is first produced, pressured up, moved onto transmission systems at high volume, high pressure. Then the pressure is regulated down for the distribution assets, and that’s the reality of the value chain for the path of natural gas, proceeding through the industry infrastructure.
You have production, you have interstate transmission, you have storage, and you finally have delivery into the systems, wherever those systems may be.
Russel: Would you say that the demand for natural gas is going up, staying flat, or going down?
Michael: That traditionally has been a situation where demand has grown steadily over the last 30 or 40 years at paces that have changed, given the nature of populations. Traditionally, it has gone up three to four to five percent across the country.
More recently, with energy conservation activities, with better insulation, better construction techniques, gas demand is declining because of those kinds of issues. The thing that’s impacting it today that we’re going to talk a little more about is how and where natural gas is produced, how it’s combusted and the resultant greenhouse gas emissions, primarily in the form of CO2.
Gas operations typically have very small amounts of vented gas that create methane emissions into our environment, and environmental restrictions are driving demand on a downward curve, so much so that the requirements to reduce greenhouse gas emissions across the country are driving many, many utilities to consider alternative fuels like hydrogen, or even electric systems.
Russel: I guess that’s a little counterintuitive for me, because my understanding is that, particularly in the Northeast, around the population centers, there’s a growing demand for energy, and consequently, a growing demand for natural gas.
Michael: That is a true view of the world, when you look at primarily that Northeast area, and the Upper Midwest area, but in the Northeast area, traditionally, that’s been driven by a conversion from fuel oil to natural gas. In the ’90s, natural gas was always touted as the clean energy source, as opposed to fuel oil, diesel, and other types of fuels.
That conversion is well underway. Capacity to the Northeast has grown over the years through the interstate systems, and several of the gas distribution utilities have seen their demand increase. Those are also some of the very tough markets to expand the use of natural gas because of these greenhouse gas emissions requirements that are starting to come into play.
There are many, many of those being considered in the Northeast, in Massachusetts, in New York, and other locations, and certainly, across the country, you’re going to see a push towards that environment, reducing greenhouse gas emissions.
We need to figure out a way where we can sustain natural gas demand without creating more greenhouse gas emissions. We need to reduce those greenhouse gas emissions while continuing to deliver natural gas.
Russel: Yeah. I think there’s a lot bound up in that whole conversation. You’re probably closer to it than me. I tend to think that we’re headed to some supply bottlenecks, because there’s a lot of infrastructure that got kicked off or discussed and was justified based on demand, and then was never built.
Russel: It’s interesting that you’re saying that, overall, natural gas demand is falling in the US. I hadn’t heard that before. That’s new information for me.
Michael: Yes. I think you could look at any number of publications that are out there – AGA being one, INGAA being another – where you could see a downward trend of one to two to three percent over the next 5 to 10 years, because of this environmental impact, and because of the drive to reduce the greenhouse gas emissions.
There was a report that came out here recently that CO2 in our airspace and in our environment has reached all-time high levels. I think, under the current administration and other types of situations, you’re going to see increased pressure on reducing greenhouse gas emissions. That can’t help natural gas expand, in my opinion.
Russel: It’s interesting. I would agree with you. I do think we’re going to see increased and continued pressure to reduce emissions. It’s probably a good thing for us to reduce emissions, just the same as it’s a good thing for us to treat water and make sure we keep the water clean.
It’s challenging. I know that one of the big things that people are talking about is the use of hydrogen as a mechanism to reduce emissions. You mentioned you’re doing work with the INGAA Foundation to look at that. What are you seeing as some of the realities around hydrogen and how that’s actually going to impact our ability to reduce emissions and yet meet demand?
Michael: At a very basic level, hydrogen provides an opportunity to take an incremental step towards reducing greenhouse gas emissions. Hydrogen molecules exist as pure H2. When it is combusted according to a stoichiometric equation, it results in the production of water, where most hydrogen is produced from water. It’s a little bit of a circular situation.
The tough part about hydrogen and reducing greenhouse gas emissions, I really believe it’s an incremental step, because the BTU content of pure hydrogen is around 325 BTUs per standard cubic foot, as opposed to natural gas, which is nominally 1,020 BTUs per standard cubic foot.
It’s a very linear type of extrapolation to say, “If we blend 10 percent hydrogen with 90 percent natural gas, now, you see your BTU content dropped down to about 950, 960.” If you go to 20 percent, like the Europeans are doing, you see a resultant energy content of 900 BTUs per standard cubic foot.
What that means in the supply demand discussion we’ve been having is, in order to deliver the same energy content that you were delivering previously, you would have to have more volumetric capacity to push that lower BTU gas through to the end users.
Russel: For me, going to AGA and sitting through a bunch of the hydrogen presentations, that was one of my big takeaways. It’s like, “OK, so, now I’m burning less natural gas and more hydrogen, but if I’m going to boil water and cook my rice for dinner, I still need the same amount of BTUs to boil the water and cook the rice as I did before, but now, I’ve got to flow more gas.
Michael: That’s correct, and interestingly enough, because you have to flow more gas, if we use the 20 percent example of 20 percent hydrogen blended in, you don’t get a 20 percent reduction in CO2 emissions, you get about seven to eight percent because of what we just said.
You have to deliver more volumetric capacity of lower energy content, so you really haven’t got a one for one relationship between CO2 emissions and how much hydrogen you’ve put on. It’s about 40 percent of a 20 percent blend, which is all you get in greenhouse gas reductions.
Russel: There’s all kinds of economic questions that come out of that, which I don’t really want to explore in this conversation. I think that’s fascinating, because now, if you say, “OK, so, now, at a 10 percent mix, I’m going to need to move five percent more volume?”
Michael: At least, yes, at least.
Russel: OK, or 10 percent more volume. Well, how am I going to do that? That’s the real question, because I’m not building any new infrastructure. I’m not building any new pipelines, at least not currently. How am I going to move this additional volume through my system?
Michael: There’s a number of ways to do that. It is a function of can you replace existing pipe capacity, and using a very basic level, if you have a 6-inch distribution line, and you have to move 10 to 15 percent more volume through that line to the customers to get the energy content, you’re probably looking at a 8-inch or 10-inch pipeline replacement for that existing 6-inch.
You want to build some extra capacity as we begin to study this more and more. The other way is to increase the pressure on your system. A lot of the utilities in this country are looking at just that. As I worked my way through this industry, distribution pressure was always considered to be about 60 pounds. At some companies, 100 pounds was the limit on distribution. That’s no longer how they’re looking at it. They’re looking at it as a function of the specified minimum yield strength of the pipe, which is a very basic Barlow’s calculation, according to PHMSA rules.
If you operate below 20 percent specified minimum yield strength, then you are distribution. There are distribution systems, Russel, in this country that are operating in the hundreds of pounds MAOP pressure, which is allowing them to deliver more energy to their customers.
It also allows them to avoid some of the more onerous transmission O&M maintenance and operating procedures. You have to have pressure, or you have to have volumetric capacity in your system to deliver that increased energy.
Russel: That raises, I think, a really interesting question around just how much capacity in existing infrastructure is available to run at higher pressure. The minute you start talking about larger pipes, now, you’re talking about a dig-and-replace kind of program.
Michael: Yes. I think that’s where you’re going to see most of the pipeline construction going forward. It is going to be replaced. It is going to be driven by this issue of demand for lower BTU gas that’s coming.
It’s going to be driven by integrity management issues. They’re all intertwined, because as we were talking earlier, there’s not a lot of big diameter transmission pipelines being approved in this country. In order to increase the amount of energy delivered through existing infrastructure, existing may be a relative term.
Do you have space in your pipe for more pressure? If so, you can increase the pressure using compression or you can increase the MAOP of the system through replacement.. It is going to be a challenge to push more volume of lower BTU gas to the customers. It’s pressure or it’s pipe capacity. It is going to be a challenge. It is particularly challenging when most of the utilities are striving to meet a 2050 date for net zero carbon emissions. That’s going to be a real challenge.
Russel: The other thing you get to with some of the new rules, as you start to upsize these pipes, they start falling under different classifications in terms of what’s required from O&M, and what’s required for your integrity management, and such.
There’s a lot that goes into upsizing pipe in a utility network that is unintended or not yet fully understood consequences of doing these kinds of things.
Michael: As you alluded to in the Northeast, population is continuing to expand there and other places in our country. You have more and more class location changes. You have more and more high consequence areas.
As you increase the pressure in your traditional pipe systems, now, you have to reevaluate things like potential impact radiuses for possible ruptures or explosions, and how are we going to protect the public from this increased pressure?
It’s all intertwined in a very, call it a spider web, if you will, of different regulations. It’s not just, “Well, we’re going to put hydrogen in there, we’ll increase the pressure, everybody will be happy.” I am not sure it’s going to work out that way.
Russel: One of the other questions that’s been up for me, and I don’t know if you know the answer to this, but I’m going to ask it anyways. I think people pretty well understand natural gas, how it’s going to behave, and what its safety issues are.
What are the differences between just pure natural gas and a mix of natural gas and hydrogen from an infrastructure safety perspective? Beyond pressure and such, is it more or less combustible? What are the issues there?
Michael: As you alluded to, we understand the explosive range or the flammability range of natural gas. That is about 4 percent natural gas mix in air at the start of the flammability range, and at about 14 percent in air at the upper end. Below 4% the mixture is too lean and above 14%, the mixture too rich to burn or explode. That’s a fairly narrow band, and it has been one of the primary safety drivers for utilizing natural gas.
Pure hydrogen, on the other hand, has the same basic lower limit of flammability at four to five percent in air, but the upper end is 75 percent. You have a wide range of flammable, explosive mixtures in air. As you consider that wide range, what does it mean to the customers, and to the production, and to the pipeline operators? Hydrogen leaks are flammable/explosive over a wide range and utility response to hydrogen leaks will necessarily be urgent. Trouble calls take on a new meaning when hydrogen is present.
That means you have to pay very close attention to leaks and potential leak sources. You have to educate your residential and commercial users to this effect as you start to deliver hydrogen to them. It is a very small molecule.
H2 is much smaller than a methane molecule, and so your flange connections, your valves, your meters, your regulators, all have to be very, very tight because of this wide range of flammability of hydrogen. That, to me, is the primary safety consideration.
If it is controlled, and there are no leaks, a 15 to 20 percent blend of hydrogen and natural gas is going to have minimal impact on the performance of appliances, furnaces, water heaters, and stovetops. Minimal, minimal, almost imperceptible differences.
It does burn a little differently in the UV range. In normal daylight, you can’t see it burning very well. Those are some things that have to be addressed as utility operators start to deliver this product to their customers.
There’s going to be a huge public awareness campaign with that. They’re going to have to be looking at parallel operator qualification issues for their employees to operate these systems. Their employees are going to have to carry special hydrogen detection equipment, so that they can detect these small leaks.
There’s going to be some diligence as the industry learns how to deal with this product, hydrogen blended into natural gas.
Russel: Does hydrogen ignite differently than natural gas? I know I’m asking a complicated question, but you need a flame to ignite natural gas.
Michael: Yeah, so the basic stoichiometric equation you have a fuel – that’s the hydrogen natural gas blend – you need air as the oxidant, and you need a spark source, or as you put it, a flame. Those are all very similar.
The difference, really, is what I was saying earlier, is that hydrogen can burn over a much wider range before it gets too rich to burn anymore.
Russel: You have more explosive risk because of that.
Michael: That’s right.
Russel: When you mix it into methane, you’re going to have more explosive risk, and you’re going to have an energy release that’s higher because of the methane. If the hydrogen lights, the methane’s going to go with it.
Michael: That’s right.
Russel: Yeah, interesting. It’s been very interesting to me. I’ve done several podcasts now on this whole issue of hydrogen. I think I’m just now beginning to get a clue, a little bit of a clue, about all the things that are required to actually get to someplace meaningful with hydrogen.
Of course, being an engineer, and being a guy who’s always looking at the numbers, I keep asking, “Well, what’s the real value proposition?” I think you said that upfront. The real value proposition is, for all of this effort, we get a reduction in CO2 emissions.
Michael: Correct. The value chain on it is similar to natural gas, but the financial value chain is completely different, because the production of hydrogen is most economically performed by using renewable – call it green – electricity in an electrolysis type of system to split the water molecules, but that’s not always available.
Hydrogen can be stored at higher pressures in vessels. There’s still a lot of debate about storage with this INGAA Foundation study that I chair. PRCI has put out a report on underground storage of hydrogen. Hydrogen doesn’t work real well with wet underground storage. It works much better in dry salt caverns, because you don’t want to mix the hydrogen with water.
Russel: Yeah, and that’s interesting as well, too. What happens if you mix hydrogen with water?
Michael: Well, particularly in the downhole reservoir type of application, mixing with water, and with whatever other impurities are in the natural gas side of the blend, high probability of acid production, primarily carbonic acids and sulfuric acids, if there’s any grains of the sulfur in the gas, as allowed by FERC tariffs.
When you create those situations with hydrogen, you’re going to be eating up downhole tubing in reservoirs very quickly.
Russel: That’s what I remember from my days working in cryogenics is hydrogen was a promiscuous atom.
Russel: It does not like being unattached. It likes to attach things. Often, when it attaches to things, it creates things we don’t want to have to deal with. Interesting.
Look, what other approaches are out there that people are looking at for getting emissions down out of the gas utility systems?
Michael: There’s a lot of research going on across the globe, actually. Australians are doing a lot of things. Clearly, the Europeans, through the Germans, and the Brits. In the UK, there’s a huge push to increase the amount of hydrogen.
A lot of those studies are really looking at the impacts of consumer use of the blend. What I’m most interested in, because I’ve been in this industry so long, I just have a hard time accepting that we can’t continue to use natural gas.
I’ve been exposed to some research to use gas heat pumps, and gas heat pumps would allow a thermal energy extraction process without combusting the gas and not creating the CO2. A big reduction there. I think that’s going to be what I see as the path forward over the next 10 years. New technology is continuing to be developed to help continue the use of natural gas for home heating, for all others?
I will tell you, I don’t want an electric heat pump here in Colorado, where I live. It gets cold here.
Russel: Oh, no, no.
Michael: I like when it’s warm out, but…
Russel: I don’t want to have to live in Houston without an air conditioner.
Michael: Absolutely. The study with INGAA Foundation is for our INGAA members to allow them to evaluate their transmission systems. There’s a lot of that going on, Russel, on the distribution side, looking at elastomers in assets, looking at the pipe, looking at presence of cast iron and PVC pipe. Those pipes will likely be replaced with MDE or HDE plastic pipe. MDE and HDE work very well in hydrogen service without embrittlement concerns
If you’re on the transmission side, with some higher grade steels, like X65, X70, X80, you’re going to have to think real hard about whether you want to blend hydrogen into those systems, because there can be embrittlement issues. I see the future of this product growing in use as being, what is going to happen to the consumer, and how can we allow the use of natural gas in the residential, commercial, industrial load, without the greenhouse gas emissions?
If we can solve that question, I think natural gas has a future. If we can’t solve that question, I don’t know, post 2050, where we’re going to be.
Russel: This is just me waxing philosophic. I have no basis for what I’m getting ready to say, but when I look at this, we’re continuing to find new ways to create energy, and each of these types of energy that we’re creating have uses that make a lot of sense and uses that don’t make a lot of sense.
In particular, when you start talking about heating and cooling homes, which is a big part of the natural gas demand, it gets difficult to get clear about how am I going to heat and cool homes without natural gas?
Now, can we figure that out? I have confidence that pretty much anything can get figured out, but it’s certainly unclear in my mind how you do that.
Michael: I wax philosophically on that all the time, too, Russel. I look across the country, and it’s a country of 350 million people and growing. There’s 100 million to 150 million homes out there, using gas to heat their homes. Is there a way to capture that CO2 at the residential level?
That’s a monumental undertaking, but the best and brightest engineering minds in this country ought to be able to solve that problem. I think we’re not focused on that yet.
Russel: I think that’s a really compelling idea, Mike, I really do. Right now, people already are getting natural gas to their homes, and they’re putting in backup generators, so that when power goes out after a hurricane or whatever, they have the ability to continue to get power.
When you start thinking about, well, if there were a process that I could implement where I could use the natural gas without creating the emissions, and I could use the natural gas to generate electricity for my house without creating the emissions, well, hey, that has some pretty radical possibilities.
Michael: Exactly. I think the power plants and the electric generating industry enjoy something of an advantage here, because they are creating emissions through the power generation, but they’re captive at a very small site, at a power plant.
You can go through carbon capture, carbon sequestration, whatever the process that they’re going to reduce those emissions at the power plants with blending and capturing the emissions. When you talk about 150 million to 200 million homes scattered all across this country – and there’s not a lot of emissions coming off each one of those individual homes, but in total, that’s a lot of emissions – how do you capture that?
That’s where I think the next 20 years is going to show us a lot on how we can do that. If we can capture that at the residential level, I think we can start to make a serious dent in this greenhouse gas emissions problem, and it’s real.
Russel: Certainly, I think it’s important that we’re good stewards of the environment. To be a good steward, I’m active in the Boy Scouts, and one of the things you always talk about is, “Leave no sign.” You want to go out in the woods, enjoy your time in the woods, and then leave, and nobody should know you were in the woods.
I think that that way of thinking about the environment and conservation applies to all things, including air.
Russel: Anyways, well, look, this has been as always, Mike, it’s always very informative when I talk to you. I’ve learned a number of things I didn’t know. I need to put together a little three by five card and get all the rules of thumbs down about, well, natural gas is 1,250, and hydrogen’s 400. If I mix it at 10 percent, then I’m going to burn this much more.
I need a little cheat sheet, so I can just rapidly access those answers.
Michael: I’ll get you some information on that, because I think about that all the time.
Russel: I tell you what, if anybody ever created a little five-by-seven thing that we could do as a PDF, I’ll bet a lot of people would be interested to get it.
Michael: OK, let me see what I can do. Amanda, you might have to help me with that.
Amanda: Action items at its finest. [laughs]
Russel: For those listeners that don’t know, Amanda has been sitting here listening in the background. She was here to collect work that we were going to give her. Hey, look, this has been fun, Mike. I appreciate it.
Michael: Yes, thank you.
Russel: I hope you enjoyed this week’s episode of the Pipeliners Podcast and our conversation with Mike. Just a reminder before you go. You should register to win our customized Pipeliners Podcast Yeti tumbler. Simply visit PipelinePodcastNetwork.com/win, and enter yourself in the drawing.
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Transcription by CastingWords